SEASON 3 , EPISODE 7
Growing British: The Vision Behind Horti House with Ed Hill

In this episode of The Underground Podcast, Phil and Kate sit down with Ed Hill, founder of Horti House, a groundbreaking collective of British houseplant nurseries. From his unconventional journey—from professional sailing to working in tech start-ups—Ed shares how his diverse background equipped him to champion British growers and reshape the houseplant industry.
Discover how Horti House is bridging the gap between nurseries and retailers, solving logistical challenges, and advocating for sustainability with initiatives like peat-free growing and biomass heating. Ed explains the importance of collaboration in an industry often seen as traditional and highlights how innovation can enhance the value of British-grown houseplants. Whether you're an avid gardener or simply plant-curious, this conversation offers unique insights into the future of horticulture and the role of green spaces in our lives.
LISTEN TO THE EPISODE HERE:
WATCH THE EPISODE HERE:
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
Phil So I'm delighted to welcome on the show today, Ed Hill from Horti House. Ed Hi. How are you? Phil Very good. Thank you very much. Kate Morning Ed, ...
Phil
So I'm delighted to welcome on the show today, Ed Hill from Horti House.
Ed
Hi. How are you?
Phil
Very good. Thank you very much.
Kate
Morning Ed, thanks for coming on.
Ed
Pleasure. Nice to be here during Christmas time as well. Just coming up to,
Kate
Well, I think this is probably going out in January, but, I think we can talk about Christmas. Definitely. So, Ed, let's kick off and find out a bit more about you. So can you tell us a bit about your background? As I gather, you've had quite, an interesting and diverse career before, starting with the Horti House.
Ed
Yeah. I'm always, try to be as honest as possible and sometimes have imposter syndrome when, speaking to horticulturalists. My background isn’t in horticulture. Yeah. I spent, probably the first part of my career sailing professionally, at very high level racing. So sort of high performance sport, mostly team orientated, and then building up quite big, big sort of, sailing campaigns that were racing around the world or doing individual solo sailing.
So that was where I came from.
Kate
That is a wow! That’s a wow moment.
Ed
Yeah. It’s probably not the normal route into horticulture, I would imagine. But it's funny how I've kind of got here in a way, because, I took the, teamwork and the project work and everything like that and moved that across to working in various high growth start ups. And there's so much similarities between getting a team, getting a vision, and getting a very goal orientated to, like, really drive small businesses and help them grow.
And so, yeah, that's I worked in various Start-Ups and then, eventually, got a phone call around Covid time from the MD here Andy Burton, Double H nurseries that is, with the move to when they're trying to move their business online during Covid. So that's how I sort of came into horticulture.
Phil
Right. So were you already working with, Start-Ups in that online sphere. Is that is that how they got in touch with you because they knew you through that or what?
Ed
Yeah, exactly. I was, I was, working in London at the time and had been for various, years up, up in London and mostly see all sort of online marketplace concepts. So I developed a business which was, hospitality business, a marketing and booking platform for boutique country pubs. And they sort of sorting out the, one side, the supply of all these beautiful places to stay with and, market into customers and providing a central point.
So, that's how the team got to know me.
Kate
So not the best business to be in during Covid, though.
Ed
No, no. Okay. It was it was interesting. And I guess this is the same from the horticulture. It's amazing how everyone came round together. Before Covid, there was, you know, people were very coy and it was quite hard to get people to see, like, almost a bigger picture. And as soon as Covid hit everyone suddenly scratched their heads and sort of thought rather than thinking about the individual and your own company, what about the actual industry itself? And I imagine that was very similar to horticulture.
Kate
Right. Yeah, yeah. Very true.
Phil
So you helped to get Double H Nurseries online and introduced their, sort of e-commerce or, and I presume it was an e-commerce system that you were, you were implementing. What then led you to, evolve that into Horti House?
Ed
Yeah, it's a really interesting, move across from we developed quite a lot of e-commerce speciality and expertise in that area. And started doing some pretty major fulfilment for big online houseplant brands. I think Patch Plants think M&S.com, you know, so we developed some really good expertise there. And that almost opened the door for us to diversify the business even more.
But it, it actually it was actually a garden centre. Own it. Behind Double H Nurseries is the beautiful Chewton Glen Hotel. And a garden centre owner was, staying there with his wife, and swung in and said I hey, you guys grow orchids and everyone sort of sort of looked at this personally bought and said, we do, but not for garden centres.
And then that was a really interesting question. As soon as the person walked out, I sort of walked over to the sales guy and said, why don't we sell to garden centres?
And it was all these sort of historical issues, which technologies actually allowed us to get over. Things like they're very complicated. They require really specific needs and they're quite, you know, small volume is one trolley per site rather than heaps of trolleys or going out into one location. And if you look at what e-commerce is transformed in the industry in the last ten years, in terms of millions of deliveries direct to doors of individual people's houses, then actually, if you think about it like that, garden centres shouldn't be that complex.
Neither should a florist or anything else where actually you're combining at least a trolley full of products to one site. So and it's the more the more we started to ask why it just became so apparent, the need for something. It was really hard. It turned out to get British products, as a garden centre, there's a huge increase in complexity with Brexit and plants that people can't access.
And so since we started to ask the question, it's like, well, we need to start cracking on this because there's a massive opportunity here. And that's how it all started really.
Phil
Fantastic.
Kate
Ed would, you just tell, for those that don't know. So double H is most famous for their orchids, house plants… and it is massive isn't it. It's absolutely huge.
Ed
Yeah. It's an amazing place. And I think you have to see it to believe it. Especially in the UK. The scale of what they do from an indoor house plant, there's an eight hectare site down in the edge of the New Forest. Southerly location, great sunlight. So from a UK perspective, from a growing about as good as you can get, and it's a really interesting, forward thinking third generation family business now, and they predominantly grow orchids, flowering houseplants, like Kalanchoe chrysanthemums. And then now green plants as well. So, yeah, it's a really, really good business they've got down here and very open minded and, about how they diversify and look to the future, which the Horti House is now going to be a major part of.
Kate
Wonderful. Now I will I've been lucky enough to visit and it is an absolutely stunning, stunning operation and and yeah, it was a it was a great morning going and seeing all those orchids. Oh my goodness me. It was it was incredible.
Phil
Yeah. So that's quite interesting because I mean before I really delved into understanding about nurseries and sort of the growers in the UK and worldwide, but specifically in the UK, I sort of always imagined that a nursery was like a load of polytunnels and, you know, people going up and down with, with hoses or watering cans and hoses, probably you know, and that sort of thing.
But it's completely different. I mean, it's completely sort of, changed from that. I mean, that may have been how it was like 20 years ago or 30 years ago, but it's very different now. Can you explain just a little bit about the operation that you have?
Ed
Yeah. It's very it's very automated in terms of to, to grow and be commercially successful at scale, that you need a high level of automation and technical expertise, I guess, in growing particular crops. So the operation there, it's, you know, we're growing, I think about one and a half to 2 million orchids every year here at Double H Nursery.
So it gives you a perspective in terms of getting it right, really important when you're growing at that scale and also being very controlled in the environment you're in and you know, we see some brilliant, growers around the country who are sort of dabbling in growing different things. And that's quite a different environment to when you're trying to grow a specific crop, at scale.
And there it's the control of the environment when you go in. And if you've been down here, you'll see it. You know, you walk in and it's a consistent, 28 degree temperature in the hot zone for the orchids every day of the year. And those types of things, you know, watering schemes and everything around it is about trying to ensure that these plants are grown exactly the same throughout the year. So that they're always available.
Phil
Right. Okay. That, that's I mean, it is fascinating. I find all of that sort of side of things, you know, truly inspiring me.
Kate
You need to visit Phil.
Phil
I really do. Yeah, I really do. So you're explaining Ed about, how so the idea of Horti House came about. Can you just tell us a little bit more about, you know, it's a collective, isn't it? Is that right?
Ed
Yeah. That's right. I mean, we started, I think it's February last year. So February 23 with, we had, I think, five products we were offering, and it was like, let's just get something going and see if anyone bites. And as soon as the immediate reaction from people was so, so positive, being able to get British products and we were initially just sending them out in the post, boxes of 12 orchids or, box of 12 green plants and, immediately everyone said yes, but what else can you do? What else can you offer?
And that led very quickly to us having discussion with Berry Lane Farm, who are based up in Cambridgeshire. And they, they've got a really interesting facility up there where they're growing Peat Free green plants. And, and it it became really apparent that to, to offer something really compelling to the UK market, we needed to have a, a diverse range of plants. And that's why we've got the collective. Actually, we're not the only people in the UK growing, and it's very hard for the garden centre customer or florist or whoever to actually find a single source where they can get these British products. So the more we, the more we did it, the more became very apparent that just yeah, get as many people working together to supply into a single route. Basically.
Kate
Interesting. So, why why the a collective I mean, I know you said about getting more, more plant. So, does that not take away opportunities from, from Double H itself? Could you not then be able to supply more plants, different sorts of plants, or did you want to kind of be with other people as part of the journey?
Ed
Yeah, I think I, I think the opposite. I think actually the more you worked together, the more opportunity there is. And maybe that's not something controversially, maybe in the UK. I don't think we've been very good at collaborating. I think there's a lot of there's a lot of history in growing. There's a lot of, things that have happened over ten, 20, 30, 40, 50 years, even that makes us quite different from how the Dutch to where they are incredibly good at collaborating. They work together, they sit down. They work They decide that X and Y is greater growing this crops, they'll do that one and then B and C will do the other crop. And we historically in the UK haven't done that. Where you'll see it in the in the houseplant market, you'll see three of the biggest growers growing the same crop. Or you did. Which doesn't feel like we're playing to our strengths. So actually it's really important neglected to actually sit down and just look at there's enough for everyone here. In fact, we can't supply everything, you know, if we. So actually, you know, there's this, that we're not capped by the market. So actually, it's just looking at trying to work together, how much you can learn from each other around successes and failures.
And. Yeah, just trying to make it as easy as possible to get our products as, as British growers into the UK market.
Kate
Yeah. That's brilliant.
Phil
Yeah. So what's the membership model that you have for tea House then you have like specific criteria for people joining that sort of thing.
Ed
Yeah. It's it's pre-selected. There's only a certain amount of UK growers around, who are growing indoor houseplants. But we've, we've been really open to any of the UK growers to come speak to us and we’ve proactively gone out and spoken to growers, and we've looked a lot around market data, around sales data around what garden centres are taking. So what do we need to have as our core range? And then we've gone to specific growers and said, you're really good at this. Can we can we take that, and put it into the Horti House? And, so it's the whole point here is that it needs to work for the growers. It needs to work for everyone.
So actually, so vision here should be that as a UK grower, you've got a consistent outlet for your product, and that you're getting a really good, decent margin for it, you’re not kind of getting pushed down to the bottom, and actually so we can help support growers where we can actually offer a consistent, consistent products and margin basically.
Phil
Right. And probably a really stupid question, but it's all houseplants. Is it.
Ed
Yeah. At the moment, at the moment. And occasionally someone, we sort of walk in and be like, oh, we've had these outdoor plants and, there's, there's enough of an opportunity. And one thing I've learned through various failures, probably more than successes, is diversify too early. And you become not very good at everything rather than really good at something.
So, yeah. There's just such an opportunity in house plants at the moment. But for what I think makes us very different is when I say house plants, it's not just the growing here we're talking around. We're talking about from the start. Yes, the growing, but all the way through to how the house plants are, put together and marketed.
So we're talking around the, you know, we've got our own in-house team, designing ceramics. So the whole product development is really, really important. And, you know, how we can elevate those plants in a retail setting with things like care cards and information. So it's much more than, buying a house plant from a Dutch importer where you're just basically taking the plant, you're finding your pot somewhere else.
We're trying to look at the UK market, look what UK consumers want, and provide a full service around that. So, that's a really important difference, I think, between us and anyone else is that sort of 360 offering.
Phil
Right. You mentioned there about having an in-house team. So, so you have a like a marketing team that's specific to Horti House, and they do all of these different bits. You present the brand to the market and, and that side of things. Is that right?
Ed
Yes. I wish we had a marketing team, around us. And, that might be, as we grow a bit more, it's we're fairly bootstrapped on the marketing side, but where we, where we do have a huge amount of expertise is, and actually, it doesn't look like I'm in a particularly nice room here, but, I mean, one of the, behind me is a whole lady of, trend analysis and trend boards and things.
So, it's all, we do have a brilliant, product development team here that Double H has. And we've managed to tap in and utilise that resource. So we're designing products for the UK consumer, and that's a really big difference I think. So we're very aware of what the UK trend is compared to a more sort of European influence.
And I think there is a big difference there. But yeah, the marketing, the Horti House, as far as we're concerned, is a very B2B brand at the moment. We're not that, you know, as, as an end customer, I don't need work. I'm not expecting someone to walk into a garden centre and say, hey, can I have a Horti House Monstera?
But I would hope that we've created enough noise and, bothered enough people that everyone knows about the Horti House from a B2B side to the industry should hopefully know about the Horti House. And then we're presenting this offering, which then they can put into their centres.
Kate
Right. So I just, I know Dibleys quite well. So Dibleys is a supply for Horti House, is that right? So if you go to a garden centre, we do know that that is, say, a Dibleys Streptocarpus, or you wouldn't necessarily know that it is just a Streptocarpus. So it have the the kind of grower rather than the Horti House kind of label on it.
Is that how it would work?
Ed
Yeah, exactly. And Dibleys are a really great example for us of where that was. That felt like a big moment for us getting Dibleys on board, you know, with the amount of gold medals they've won and the prestige and, and especially in this garden centre industry they’re incredibly well respected for good reasons. Yeah. So it's yeah, you would as, as us supplying into garden centres there. We've just reduced down. Dibleys problem was that they were I think they had to have nine trays minimum order, which for Streptocarpus outside of the key season's quite hard for a garden centre from a waste perspective. So we're bringing their products together, consolidating it with other, plants here and then shipping it out. So, actually, someone could have one tray per week and reduce their waste and ensure the freshness of the plants when they're arrive.
So yes, as a customer, you would go in and you would see Streptocarpus and for Dibleys we did actually brand their pots as Dibleys pots. And I think for them where they've got such strong brands, we should be absolutely just helping support that rather than take it away. For other growers, if you don't have a consumer brands, that's not a problem.
They'll just sit with the other marketed as British and or houseplants and play on their other strengths, whether that's peat free or whatever else it might be.
Kate
Yeah, yeah. So, it's great to see that there are British grown houseplants because that's been really hard to source. But, one of one of the things that interests me is the peat free part of your collective. And especially you have a carnivorous grower. Is that right? And one of the, the kind of plant groups that people are saying you cannot grow in peat for carnivorous. But, I see that the collective is proudly peat free on its website. And, is this part of a larger sustainability strategy, would you say?
Ed
Yeah. Peat free is really important. It's I think it's an overused word and probably I wonder, I wonder at what point the industry will get bored about talking about peat free that’s an interesting…
Kate
Once legislation comes in.
Ed
In, I know. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And I think it's vitally important, but, I think people can get bit lost in it all as well. Is my view. And the more I got sort of looked into, that the more it becomes. It's just it's so divisive an issue. And I think, I think everyone's on the journey, and I think there's certain growers who have had huge success and have moved or transitioned everything that they're growing into peat free media.
I think there's still a way to go in terms of the, plugs for the plants, unless you're self propagating, then, I think there's a bit of work to be done there, but I think we'll get there and that we're talking about 0.5 percent or. Yeah, 0.5 percent or less of peat within that product.
And I think I always use the, alcohol free analogy where an alcohol free beer can still have 0.5% in it, and we know it is still like a little bit that it's just helping it taste good or helping the plant survive. And I think we'll get better that it was proven the first trials of anyone's in peat free media has been probably been terrible, but over work and over years. You improve that. So I'm keen that the industry doesn't rush the final 0.1 of a percent or whatever it will be. I'm not sure that's helpful for anyone. If the customer isn't successful with their plants, then they get and will do more damage to the industry I believe. Than just letting that small percentage of peat slowly trickle out, over the next 4 or 5 years until it will be 100% peat free.
Phil
Well, I think when you're talking about the volume of plants that you describing earlier on that you produce, I mean, I think that's where I think for the layman, you don't really associate the volume of plants. And, you know, for that, if all of those plants failed, I mean, that is a huge thing, isn't it?
Ed
Yeah. The commercial risk on, you know, it's millions of pounds worth of young plants. And then you need to be very clear that they're going to be successful. And the hardest one here is you think if they're an orchid that's, you know, grows here for over a year before it's ready to go out. So it's a huge investment, a time and energy and love and the rest of it to get that plant ready to go into customers house, and say it is risky to make any sort of massive knee jerk reactions.
And, you know, I've been lucky to see and I sit on the management team of Double H nurseries and seeing, you know, we're working with the actual horticultural experts within the team here and see, you know, they've been working on, options around peat free for the last ten years plus. And it was only last year with a bit of a push from a few people, to actually just make that final move over. And actually, it was more actually to simplify the operation where there was there was potentially some risk, but more risk was having these different substrates, some of peat, some without. And they do require a different watering and feed. And the rest of it say actually we turned around, said, look, the cost is bearable. There's a small increase in cost, but actually, let's just make the move and proactively just get everything in peat free. So that was really important from us, from that side.
But that was years of work. And I think I genuinely think everyone… no one's trying to do the wrong thing within the industry. And some people are just probably a little bit behind the curve, in terms of where they're at. But I don’t think we should sort of should make their life too difficult because they're desperately trying to make the right moves.
So it's just. Yeah, be sensible with that, I think.
Kate
Yeah, I mean, although I kind of class myself as a peat free expert and somebody that offers peat free training. Ideally, you know, I don't want to be asking these questions on the podcast next year. You know, is it, as you said, you know, let's get away from it. And we just be talking about compost and growing media rather than everything having to be about peat free.
So let's just talk about, your larger sustainability strategy, because when I was visiting Double H, I know you talked about, the energy and watering, so just tell us a little bit about that because it's quite fascinating.
Ed
And that's, that's where we should be talking about in my view, is the sustainability of which peat is a part of it. But yeah, so we talked about peat, so let's talk about energy. That's been yeah. I mean, this growing indoor houseplants especially, you know, we need to make sure we are growing them sustainably. If you look at the heat that is used to, create these environments, look at the water we're using.
So, yeah, we use biomass boilers for our heat. So here at Double H nurseries, we're basically off grid, which is fantastic. And that's the same with same with all of our… same with Dibleys, same with Berry Lane. They've all got biomass boilers. So that's, that's, that's really important from them. And I don't think actually in the UK you could grow commercially. Now if you are having to pay your heating costs from the gas anyway. So there's good reasons to be, sustainable, from a commercial front as well.
Kate
Absolutely.
Ed
You know, this I think there's some really important things around water and irrigation and the, you know, we use runoff rainwater. There's a reservoir behind the, the buildings here that we use, so, because rainwater is much, much better than using from mains anyway, in terms of the nutrients and the rest of it.
Kate
And orchids.
Ed
So yeah, this and I think also the, the big thing that we should be challenging ourselves on is we're close to market. Our ambition here is to supply the UK market. And so we need to reduce our CO2 miles and get as local as possible plants into our centres. And that's a really important thing. And I think something which I don't think people are measuring, I think it's quite hard to put a number on, but I really believe and I’ve seen it in other industries where the focus on provenance is really important.
And having that really local supply chain, I think is, a, I think it's where everyone's going to get to, but we're trying to champion that move. And really it's, I think let people know as well where has where has your plant come from? How was it growing? And it's, it's tricky and it is difficult and even avid gardeners I think it's quite hard for them to actually get the detail of was this plant grown in, you know, in South America, shipped across on a ferry to Holland. And then was it chucked in a truck and driven halfway across the UK to then get to here, you know, is compared to something that was growing down the road and just driven up the road to the centre, you know, so there is opportunity, I think, to tell a really compelling story to actually does do what it says in, in terms of from a sustainability point of view.
Kate
And I suppose the more growers you have around the country then that that's even better. When it comes to carbon footprint with travelling. So I suppose Dibleys will be supplying garden centres near to them. Is that how it works?
Ed
Yeah, exactly. And we're still at a point of, scaling, I guess. So, you know, I can't claim we’re, you know, 100% perfect at all yet. And there's a lot of work around, where we consolidate our plants and put them together; because the key here is we need to get all of our growers’ product onto one trolley, you know, so there is there is a need to move some plants to a hub or a centre somewhere before they can go out into garden centres.
But that's the absolute ethos here is that we reduce as much as possible CO2 miles for the pass.
Kate
That's brilliant. And can I just ask, has Brexit helped British growers then because of all the issues that we're having with importing plants, or is Brexit actually working in your favour.
Ed
Yeah, it's that's a really interesting point. And going to HTA conferences and the rest, you know, you hear both sides of this story for sure. With a lot of very, very big importers who are very unhappy about Brexit. And there I mean, it has put the cost up us of plants. But I, I don't feel that the end of the world, I think they’re such a special gift and or special object that, you know, I'm always just slightly disappointed about how little they cost people in one sense.
You know, I think for what they give and what they do. I think we could charge more, but for Brexit I think it has created an opportunity. There's… I mean amount of paperwork and issues… and we import a lot of plants ourselves still from the continent. So it's created an opportunity for us to do it successfully and navigate the paperwork and be able to bring, plants in in potentially larger quantities that than we can distribute here ourselves.
So, yeah, it should create a, some friction that allows British growers to be more successful, I think. Yeah.
Phil
So would you say it that one of the biggest problems that Horti House solves is logistics? I mean, it seems like it's bringing plants from different nurseries in different quantities and then being able to supply those to the garden centres, is that right? I mean, have I read that correctly?
Ed
Yeah. I think that's, it's not the most, sexy of, like, descriptions I've heard of the Horti House, but no, I think you're right. I think…
Kate
It's not going to be on your tag line?
Ed
Logistics supply. But sadly, yeah, I think you're quite right. It's a massive part of what we do. It's, and it's looking at what the Dutch do incredibly well. And I'm not afraid to look at other industries or other sectors and see, like what these people do really well, how do they overcome these problems?
And here we've got a good example with Royal Flora Holland and the Dutch, with the collaboration, working together with the incredible logistics that they have over there of being able to bring plants from the nursery into the auction within, you know, 12 hours or whatever, and then get them out of the door. So, yeah, I think we're trying to do something similar within the UK.
So I think and it has been hugely problematic for people who want to support British when they have to deal with ten different growers, who probably aren't set up to be able to do the intricate details of retail labels and pricing and all of those other bits that, are important. And also from, you know, we've seen how stretched, say, garden centres are in terms of the costs involved now with Labour and the rest of it.
That actually, you know, what can we do to make life easier is probably not having 25 deliveries of British plants all arriving throughout a week. It's having one delivery. Here you go. All ready to go out onto your shop floor. So there is, yeah, I think it's a big part of what we're doing for sure.
Kate
So you are a one stop shop then aren’t you? Pretty much for them.
Ed
Yeah, that's definitely, probably the the key point is that one stop shop come here for everything you need. And we're desperately trying to increase what we offer to make it more and more compelling for people to support British growers. And that might be at the moment, offering some other plants which we can't grow here in the UK as well.
And I'm sort of start I sort of it's sort of almost slightly disappointing a couple of years in to say, oh, well, actually there's still a place for some other products outside the UK, but I think that's the reality at the scale we want to get to. And what we want to be for now is to actually to become a really integral part of every garden centre and florists ordering.
We actually do need to have a range which is slightly more than just British. Or it might be that, you know, we're running trials here, a great example: we're running trials here of growing Anthuriums, with, and some success. But it's going to take a long time to grow commercially, the right volume of the right quality.
And so and we also need to de-risk that for both the British grower here and also for the garden centre customer, which probably means we'll be bringing in Anthuriums in from Holland for a while until we've got the right quality and we've got a consistent order book to be able to then turn that on. So yeah, that's an interesting sort of step in, sort of evolution over the next few years, I think, where we'll be trying to maintain, an offer, just a really good range with focusing on British.
But if you can't get the right quality or it's not sustainably grown, then actually, what can we offer instead? And that's what we sort of starting to challenge ourselves on this. Yeah.
Phil
And we've talked we've talked about some of the challenges that, you facing as a British nursery and you've really well set out the fact that as Horti House, you're a champion of British growers. What do you think other things that can be done to help support British growers?
Ed
Yeah. I mean, I think the big part is the, our customers, championing it in their centres, from and I think actually I was going round a few florists recently and I think potentially where people go to their independent florists, and that they expect that to find those unique, plants or flowers that tell stories.
So it's, you know, when you give something in a florist is probably a more gifty… it's less self-purchase, probably more gifting, I imagine their market. But they're, you know, it's like the analogy of taking a bottle of wine to someone's house as a gift. And you want to tell them, I walked through the vineyard and, you know, this was it was a beautiful view.
And this is where they're growing. And I met the guy who grew it
Phil
It’s personal
Ed
Yeah, exactly. And I think that's where if actually, you know, garden centres can get behind that British grown message, which they are doing and you know, in the last year, it is so lovely to see the amount of British benches we now see where it's full of British products.
But the more people can get behind that and tell the story of this is where it was grown and then that just helps just drive demand and helps actually make it a premium product. I think that's really important. You know, it's pretty tight margins, when you're growing as you. Well, I don't know how you probably, say, you know, I think anything where we can actually allow everyone to just slightly make that a more premium products and drive a slightly better margin, I think is important.
Both for the garden centres are exactly the same, and it's a really tough targets at the moment and making themselves successful. So I think that's one where I think the more focus on the British story and where the plants come from, the better.
Phil
Yeah. And I think there is the opportunity to increase the price. I think I mean we've spoken to Michael Perry before in the past and he raised this as a, it's a really interesting point that cut flowers… if go to a florist, cut flowers are really expensive. And yet a plant which, which is going to survive so much longer, you know, is half the price.
And I think that's quite an interesting point. And something which I think should be addressed gradually over time, you know, and the value that is locked up in those plants is really important.
Ed
Yeah. I mean, it's that that's the thing where I think actually as an industry and, you know, the Horti House aren’t going to be able to change that and it's something that's going to happen over time. But it does feel we're undervaluing what plants bring to people for sure.
Kate
Yeah I think I can talk about that in a minute. Actually. I'm going to anyway,
Phil
I've just got one more question. Going back to when we were talking about the challenges, and I know you've mentioned about trying to learn from the Dutch teams and growers, how difficult is it to compete with the Netherlands? And do you see that? The, the peat free issue, obviously, we're sort of pushing for peat free, but it's not necessarily taking over in on the continent in quite the same way. Does that make it harder for you?
Ed
Yeah, I think that that they're quite good at what they do! I’ll give them that. Yeah, they, and they got huge subsidies from or have historically had huge subsidies from governments their government there to support that. So, from day one we've said we need to we will only ever be successful if we can provide the same plant, at the same price with the same quality.
But it has all these extra bits around sustainability, around peat free, around British. And that's hard, I think, to get that right with the commercials to back it. I think the peat free free’s been really good for the UK. In terms of you're right, we the UK growers and through legislation we've moved faster than, Europe and Holland.
Although I would say in the last 6 to 12 months they're starting to get on that bandwagon. So we've had sort of first mover advantage there. But I don't think that will you know that'll last. Yeah. So I think from our side, it's about the point of difference.
I think that's where we need to make a real big play around the point of difference around British growing. And I think that is where people will pay a premium for them. And that's exactly what we see in fresh produce and other areas where people are quite happy, if they know where it's from, they will pay a premium for that product if they think it's supporting, local growers.
And so I think that's, that's really important. And yeah, I think the Dutch are really good at what they do, and that's hard. You know, we've been speaking to British growers asking to grow things that haven't grown before. And that takes time. And not everything is a success overnight. So a little bit of, you know, that that's where it's difficult.
Where in Holland this so many growers and they're all growing just one thing and doing it very, very well. So that's our challenge and I think over time as we develop a UK market, by UK growers, then I think we'll get there.
Kate
So for me, it's really interesting when you say about the Netherlands having horticultural subsidies, what's what we're finding so hard in this industry is how little support the government has given. And also how it just doesn't take it as a vital industry. I mean, things are starting to change. There's various committees, visits to Parliament. There's lots of people that are really, really pushing for horticulture.
So how do you feel? Our present government can help horticulture to be recognised as this vital industry. I mean, you talked about how much pleasure plants gave, but it's not just about pleasure. It's about food. It's a mental health in so many ways that plants and horticulture is vital. What could you say to our government now that that would help?
Ed
Yeah. I mean, one thing is probably to look at the facts around the economic impact is that they're so focussed at the moment around, the economy and everything else, quite rightly. But, you know, they need to look at the economic impact that horticulture and industry makes. And if you look at those numbers, they are astonishingly large and bigger than some of the industries that potentially have a much larger voice in Westminster than our own.
And, you know, I think the HTA and other people are doing a good job of trying to change that dial and that discussion and, and really show what we do from an economic side. But yeah, I think for me, it goes a lot back to what other things that, that horticulture gives to people where from a physical mental wellbeing point of view and those may maybe a slightly harder to put a number on.
But it's, they're incredibly important. And you know, that's we can't lose sight of that as an industry in terms of what we're doing and the pleasure it gives people and potentially people who, you know, if you're, apart from doing large physical activity, you know, I think just getting people out into gardens, getting people outside is so, so important from probably, again, hard to measure the impact on the NHS.
But I'm sure there's direct correlations between that.
Kate
Well there's lots of studies that have been done that have kind of measured it. So there is research out there that quantifies that. So yeah. Absolutely right. Yeah. And also for you I mean COVID's the houseplant boom. You know that so important that people didn't have access to outside play to have those house plants to nurture to, you know, to love something.
So for the houseplant industry you know, Covid was a boom and it's still there. You know, people have really understood the importance of a green space in your home. If you haven't got access to green space outside and, you know, houseplants, you look at Instagram and it's still full, full, full, full of houseplant lovers. It's amazing. So it's so important.
Ed
Yeah. That that feels like it's that's really important, both from a overall nations perspective in terms of that wellbeing and also giving people that little bit of greenery, that bit of care if you don't have outdoor space. But it's also really important, I think from the industry side as well, to look at those are probably the, you know, people who in their teens, 20s, 30s don't have those outside spaces, you know, what are we doing to bring them into a garden centre in the first time that they come in?
Because this is a lifelong customer, you know, this is someone who, if you do it right, yes, they might move and go to a different garden centre. But as an industry as a whole, you know, it's super, super important that we, you know, welcome these people in and, you know, get that little itch starting and get them interested because it will only ever, expand.
You know, I see I've got two daughters and they're not very good looking after plants. But neither am I suppose. But they absolutely love it. And they love the idea of having this thing they're looking after. And that's a six and a three year old, you know, and it's like, how do we continue that enthusiasm for something that's alive, you know?
So, yeah.
Kate
Well put a value on it as well. So we could put more value on it as well. If something's cheap, people don't value it so much. You find that, you know that's been proven. So yeah. Stop selling plants for, you know, £4, £3 in the supermarket. Put more of a value on it. Anyway, I'll get off my soapbox.
Phil
So Ed, you mentioned earlier on about, the career you've had before you come into the, the horticultural industry, you know, from sailing to tech Start-Ups. You know, I think that's, a fascinating. I'll just be interested to find out what your views been of coming into horticulture. You know, many of our guests have sort of mentioned the friendliness and openness of the industry, I wondered what your take on it was?
Ed
Yeah. I think that your other guests are probably hitting that on the head. I mean, I when I started, I was very much, like, still tech focussed around how do we get plants out to end customers and didn't really deal too much with the industry until we kicked in, until we kicked off the Horti House, really. And it's so refreshing when people come to you and they're like, that's a really good idea. How can I help?
Or, you know, I could list off a whole list of names of people who've given me help, given their time free of charge, to, like, just discuss an idea or talk about a problem. And I'm I'm really interested to sort of present a problem and hear what someone's take on it is. Or get early thoughts on an idea… most of the ideas we have are pretty bad! So, it's quite nice to be able to, you know, to bounce them off people who are like: Yeah, I wouldn't do it quite like that!
But yeah, I mean, it's a really passionate industry. And you can understand why we the product is unbelievably special. And you can see that, you know, from it's from the industry where people are really, really passionate about what they're doing.
And, and I think it's interesting because I've always, always talk about, collaborating and not competing and trying to have as transparent a conversation as early as possible. And I've been used to in the past having these meetings where you talk around the problem, or the issue. No one really wants to show their cards because they're worried about what might happen.
And here I think it's been really good to be able to be, you know, if you start the discussion and be like, I'm going to put my cards table, this is what I’m trying to do? Yes. You could maybe… you know at the early start of the Horti House, someone else could have copied the idea or done something differently, But no one did.
And actually, by doing that, everyone just has been so supportive of our idea, and what we're trying to do, and trying to help us. So, yes, it it's a really, really incredible industry from that side. And incredibly friendly. And there's some pretty smart people in it as well. You know, I think, you know from outside people maybe, you know, think horticulture is still this sort of old, sort of old school industry. And I think actually there's the people I've worked with and alongside have been, some pretty impressive people. So, yeah, I think it's, a great place to be working right now.
Phil
Yeah. That's great to hear.
Kate
Wonderful. So kind of leading on from that. Have you caught the bug of gardening or were you a keen gardener? I mean, you said you you're not so good at keeping plants alive, has that answered my question already?
Ed
Yeah. I mean, the funny thing is my, my wife's a doctor, and she's always filled her house full of houseplants, which I liked from an aesthetic appeal, but paid very little attention to, if I'm going to be brutally honest, before, before joining Double H.
Do you know, I think I have. I really enjoy just the variety of plants that are on offer, and you know, and I know what I like and I, I, you know, I love like, plants her pots of colour or markings and, you know, I'm not and not so much down the green plant, boom I guess.
I still love plants, which just have some little bit of colour just to, like, brighten up a corner of a room. And that's where that's what I, that's what I really like. But yeah, I have an I, I now find any room where I don't have plants in a bit sad. And so, I guess and, and that does probably say, you know, that it's still probably not the best looking after the plants, but luckily I've got someone who's been passionate about it all their life.
So, I'll leave her to be the expert in that.
Kate
So she must be so pleased with what you're doing that as well.
Ed
Yeah. Oh, she finds it. Thank you. Ridiculous that I'm now, doing something where she said that. I mean, that's the joy about having being honest. You know, I always start my conversations when we're talking, walking around Double H with someone, and I'll be like, you know, you can speak to the expert, but I'm not going to profess to have years and years of horticulture experience.
But surround yourself with people who do have that experience. And, you know, hopefully I can offer a different perspective and a different way of looking at something that overall, as a team, works really well.
Kate
Wonderful. So I'm just going to finish off then. So with all the partners of the Horti House, if you could only have one plant in your house from all of those people, do you have one and why?
Ed
Yeah, I should say an orchid.
This might be my last ever discussion!
And I've actually sort of fallen for a plant similar to an orchid recently that, that we currently we don't grow in the UK, and we're trying to and say the anthurium lilies, which, again it's just how much the flower… The thing I love about an orchid is how much, how long they flower for. And, looking at, you know, the plant that flowers for months, not days and things like that, which are incredibly special and give a real value to a plant. And the anthurium lily I've been promised is going to flower for over a year.
Kate
Goodness me.
Ed
So… and it's got heaps of flowers and colour popping out of it. So that's my, Yeah, I, I'm so really hopeful that our trials that we're doing at the moment are going to come good with those, Because, I think there's a huge, huge opportunity there. And they’re just such a beautiful, easy to look after plant. And anything too difficult. And I'm probably not going to be your man! So, but yeah, that that'll be my, number one for now.
Kate
Lovely. So we'll watch this space then for hopefully offerings from the Horti House at some point.
Phil
Yeah. No that's brilliant. And I mean straight after this I think I'm going to be onto Google, googling Anthurium Lily to check out what it looks like!
So, I just want to say Ed, thanks so much for joining us today. It's been fascinating talking to you and finding out more about Double H, and also that Horti House and that compelling story that you're bringing, about British growers. And I think that's it's going to be amazing. So thank you so much.
Kate
Thank you so much for your time.
Ed
Yeah. Pleasure. Thank you.